CAUTION
Over the years magazines and books have occasionally carried articles on Pipers
You would think that this could only do the marque some good ~ but ...
Some of the information included has been misleading or poorly explained
and this has since been copied over by other journalists and used again
Even the club has been fooled by a colourful story about a GTR a few years ago
but we found out the truth afterwards ~ so beware and remember
There is more known about prehistoric stone circles than there is about Pipers !
How many of each model were produced ?
We currently believe that production figures are ~
Open sports racers ~ 4 maybe 5
Mallite single seater ~ 3
Formula Ford 1600 ~ 2 or 3?
Coupe. sports racers ~ 2
GTR Group 6 ~ 4 and possibly 1 body tub
GT A series engine ~ 4 maybe more
GT Imp engine ~ 1 or 2
GT 1500cc pre x/flow Ford engine ~ 3 or 4
GT 1600cc x/flow Ford engine ~ 4
NOTE
At least one A series engined car was changed to use Ford parts
a couple of 1500cc pre x/flow cars may have been up-dated to 1600cc x/flow
a couple of GT cars were up-dated to the later GTT spec.
a couple of GT race cars were up-dated to road car spec.
GTT 1600cc x/flow Ford engine ~ 35 ish
GTT 1558cc Lotus twin cam engine ~ possibly 2
GTT 1600cc Alfa-Romeo twin cam engine ~ 1
NOTE
a couple of GTT`s have the same chassis number ~
Whoops
a GTT body shell was made into the P2 prototype
the good parts from a damaged GTT were made into a new P2 for it`s owner
the last GTT chassis number is 39
the prototype P2 chassis number is 42
the first production P2 chassis number is 52
P2 1600cc x/flow Ford engine ~ 38 ish
P2 2000cc OHC Ford engine ~ 2
P2 1600cc BDA Ford engine ~ 1 maybe
NOTE
a couple of P2`s have the same chassis number ~
Whoops 2
just a body shell and a body and chassis were used for two modsports cars in the 1970`s
the last P2 chassis number is 92
a P2 was built up by two ex Piper employees after production finished
1558cc Lotus twin cams and 1600cc Ford BDA`s have been fitted to cars since production
How many of each model still survive ?
More than we know about ~
Tony Hilder`s model was kept by Tony and is on loan to the club ~ Cheers Tony
Two of the mallite single seaters are known to exist but unfortunately are not racing
The ex Bobby Bell open sports racer had gone out to the USA for a time
but it has been returned to England ~ Three cheers for John Bladon
The ex Le Mans GTR that went out to the USA in the early seventies
and is often seen in magazine articles in black and was registered as a road car !
in the US by Bob Mariani and it has also featured in museums and historic racing in red
is now back in the UK and will be racing again in historic events ~ Many thanks Tim
This GTR has now been sold to a new owner so lets hope he's a racer ~ are you ?
This is the only GTR that we know anything about and we can trace it`s history back
all the way to a disappointing weekend in France in the summer of 69
We have also seen recent pictures of another genuine Piper GTR in the USA
it has had some changes over the years and will be restored to the original design
a second GTR has reappeared in the USA and this has had more style changes than David Bowie
If you can help us with any GTR information ~ 'Please talk to me'
We can still find an early A series engined GT from around 1967
it has been restored and is part of a private collection of classic GRP marques
and a GT racer from around about 1967 will be out racing again soon
and a couple of early Ford engined GT`s are still with us
together with a couple of ex race cars now in road trim
A racing GT that was built in hill climb spec. and won it`s class whenever it was out
can now sometimes be seen out circuit racing ~ currently for sale
The first of Bill`s two ~ XPA 8 GTT`s ~ is out there with a different reg no. and colour
and the second one ~ the purple one is in Cyprus and has been stored away for years ~ and in the dry
The GTT built for a German customer with the Alfa engine is safe with another of our members
The last GTT produced was restored with 'a number of mods' and it lives over in Japan
About ten GTT`s are unknown to us from the possible forty ish produced
I think there are still a few out there hiding from us
with an original early A series GT that we have been told about in Scotland
and reports of an Imp powered GT as well that has been hidden away for years
The GTT that Noel Edmonds owned has been lost ever since he traded it into a motor dealer
The prototype P2 is being restored and we can still track down the first production P2
Both of the modsports racing P2`s are still with us ~ one is racing in Sweden
and the other is taking life easy now it has been changed into a road car
Both of the 2ltr OHC P2`s have been saved ~ the first works car is back with it`s boss
Bill Atkinson has his old directors car ~ GJB 999K ~ back again and he should be out in it soon
The other OHC P2 has had the biggest re-build of any of the Pipers
because it was totally written off ~ left at the side of the road
saved from a Bristol breakers yard and restored from just above the floor moulding
and re built from new factory panels and parts and then sold over to Germany
The last P2 and the car produced by ex employees are still being loved by their owners
Bill Atkinson and Tony Waller are still business partners and still live next door to each other
Again we are missing about ten P2`s from our files but I am sure half of these are somewhere safe
If you have any information or leads to cars or pictures of anything Piper ~ Please contact us
I have seen a Piper up near somewhere ~ How do I tell if it`s a GTT or a P2
First of all the P2 is six inches longer in the foot wells
It will have twin head lamps under covers or the later pop-up lamps
where the GTT should have single oblong head lamps under narrower covers
The GTT had a bonnet bulge and this changed to a air scoop on the P2
The P2 has a small lip detail on the wheel arches
and later models had Ford door handles replacing the push button
The GTT has round Imp rear lights and the P2 changed to wider Dolomite lamps
The P2 chassis has outriggers added to the backbone and you can see these just under the sill
How high is a Piper sports car ?
A GTT or P2`s roof is just 39 inches from the ground
the non-adjustable seat is trimmed to fit into the floor to gain head room
The P2 has an adjustable pedal box but the seat still needs to be trimmed for body height
The GTR has it`s roof at just under 34 inches high
and don`t forget that you would need to be wearing a crash helmet as well
Size dimensions from Piper Cars own spec. sheets
GTT ~ Length 11ft 11ins
Height 3ft 4ins
Wheelbase 7ft 2ins
P2 ~ Length 12ft 6ins
Height 3ft 5ins ~ more ground clearance
Wheelbase 7ft 8ins
Width 5ft 7ins
Track 4ft 8ins
Weight Approximately 1500 lbs.
Weight balance front to rear = 55% front 45% rear
Original tyres were 175 82% aspect ratio Good Year G800 and Dunlop SP Sport
now that we all fit low profile tyres and spring compression gives us the 39 inches high
Aren't Piper`s kit cars then ?
NO ~ The first cars built by the company were all racing cars
the open sports racer that was later made into a closed sports GT and the F3 single seater
When the GT production first started in 1967 you could indeed buy it as a part assembled kit of parts
and assemble it yourself with the intension of going out for a seasons racing
This gave you the option of fitting Sprite, Imp or Ford pre crossflow engines
This was directed at buyers who were going to race their cars and wanted something a little different
They had their own ideas and parts from last seasons race car
but could not undertake the difficult task of the body and chassis and suspension
Soon after this more sales slowly changed from race cars to road cars
There was also a financial incentive to do this because less tax was payable
when buying a car as un-built rather than a complete production vehicle
In this way you avoided paying the purchase tax
As GTT road car sales increased you had to buy the car completely built by the factory
and to get around the extra purchase tax the car was then registered by the new owner
often locally to where he lived and then they purchased the car unfinished at the time of collection
Just to keep everything legal the factory would leave off the air cleaner
or disconnect the battery leads and the owner would fit his own number plates
You could not purchase a set of body parts and build the car up yourself
or base the build up around one type of donor cars parts
All road versions are built with a collection of unique factory made parts
connecting together the modified Triumph steering and suspension and front brakes
with the engine and gear boxes and back axles selected from the performance Ford range
In 1972 new taxation rules meant that the same tax was payable on both un-built and complete cars
This killed off the small saving that could be had from avoiding the purchase tax
and Piper stopped offering un-finished cars and continued to improved the factory built cars
What problems are there from driving a Piper on the road ?
The most important item is visibility ~ seeing out and being seen
some drivers just stare at you in disbelief and some drivers just don`t see you
but then some drivers don't see Range Rovers either
The lack of opening windows is a problem in the summer ~ you just cook slowly inside
and then when you stop a crowd appears and you can`t open your doors
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